Cricket Legend Jack Brooks on The Parallels Between Sport and Business

So this week on the podcast I've got a fantastic guest that's joining me on the sofa.

He's a man that's had a fantastic sporting career, played professional cricket for 15 years, now moved into coaching but is also keen on, you know, had a brand around that he displayed on the, on the cricket field as well.

So I've got Jack Brooks, who won two County Championships with Yorkshire, played cricket for, took 531 wickets, I think it was in a professional career that lasted over 15 years.

Fantastic guy, great human being.

And I'm going to be chatting to Jack about his cricket career, what's gone on, stories around how sport and business are so similar.

Things he learned when he was building a career to achieve success at the highest level in sport or some of the highest levels in sport.

And I'm going to talk about everything in life in general.

So on the podcast this week, going to happen to chat Brooks.

So welcome back to this week's podcast.

Well, it's an absolute honor.

I've got a really good guy, good friend on the sofa in a nice comfortable environment this week.

To Mr.

Jack Brooks.

James, great, thanks for having me.

Yeah, mate, look, it's great to talk through.

We're going to talk through lots of things around life, cricket obviously, which is a big thing that you've built your career on, but talk about futures and business and that sort of stuff as well.

Just, you know, lots of things that, you know, we're going to cover off as part of the conversation and if you've got, you know, questions afterwards, I'm sure Jack's on social media, will share some details afterwards where I'm sure he'll be happy to reply to a few comments.

But I was going to ask you what first question for you was you've just retired from cricket.

When you look back now and you go, wow, what I achieved in my career, do you look back at it with a sense of, you know, real pride?

Because you achieved a lot in your career.

You were known for a lot.

You.

There's lots of stuff we'll cover off over the course of the conversation.

How'd you look back on your career?

When you think about having the years that you did in the game, you know, 531st class wickets, how do you look back on it?

Well, yeah, it's been 18 months to retire from playing and I've been coaching now for full time for a year now.

So I guess having now been out the game and yeah, 18 months, yeah, since I finished playing and in that period Particularly even this winter when I've had a bit of time off, you do suddenly get drawn into a bit more reflection which as a player you sort of live day to day and you don't really sit back and look at things and stats and think about there's still a lot to achieve.

Yeah, I'm obviously very proud of what I achieved.

But I still go back to a comment that me and my dad had in about 20, 15, 16, we're having dinner up in Leeds.

When I played for.

Yeah, I think my mum was there as well, but dad was a massive cricket foul and I think by that point I knew my chance to play for England had gone.

Yeah, it was always a massive driver for any sportsman trying to play the top level international sport, etc.

Because of my route into the game and coming in late, that 24, 25 year old, it was just even amazing to be dragged into that but to achieve quite a lot.

Played 15 years, but even like 10 years ago my dad said to me, well to be honest boy, I think you've overachieved.

And to be honest, yeah, I didn't come through any academies, any professional structure.

Played in Oxfordshire for a village side till I was 20 like and suddenly playing professional cricket four years later and England set up within a three year period of that England Lions regular over a few years and then going to Yorkshire and achieving my next goals which is winning trophies and championship, which was at the time and it still is really the biggest thing in English domestic crickets and obviously the franchise circuit, everything else has grown again hugely and my priorities would have changed pot at a different age.

But I'm very proud of what I did and to have played 15 years as a spaz and fast bowler, I mean I'd love to play one more year.

Purely to have said I played at 40 from a greedy point of view, but my body was failing mentally.

I don't think I wanted it as much and priorities in life were changing.

But there has been a lot of reflection looking back and as a coach now you do look at certain things and how you would have done it and.

But I don't miss playing.

I'm glad I parked it.

You don't miss pain.

It's funny because I was, I remember watching you before, I think rose 80 months off.

It was like a year ago but.

But you're not long retired and I mean you know, you were always a whole heart, your, your whole approach to the game was just complete commitment.

You know, if everyone saw you, you know, you will Talk about the headband in a bit.

But it was like Jack works on coming in.

I'm having you even when you're batting.

It was like, this is going to go, I'm going to give it my all.

Is that what you think?

Because to me, I know you talk about your background, which were you were sort of bit later into the game.

Is that because you think you showed?

You seemed like you wanted it more.

Is that a fair thing to say?

I don't know if I wanted it more.

I certainly appreciate what I had.

Right.

And I've had real life experience and even obviously I played for three teams in terms of contracts and I played three loan signings.

So I had a lot of experience in different environments.

But I remember speaking to someone like James Hildreth, who was a Somerset one club man.

Unbelievable career, one of the best players, never played for England, horrible tag to have.

But we're really close friends now, trying to do some business together as well.

And he just said he couldn't believe me and the environment in the changing room, having only seen me as an opponent, knowing what I'm like outside, actually how I am in the changing room environment.

And he just said the way you can seem to be able to deal with not failures, but when things don't go swell, you can park things quickly.

You just seem to come to work or have this energy every day.

And I was like, yeah, but mate, I was, you know, working on old people's home at 16, then a pub, then I was in a warehouse, then out of sales job, sat in office for four years, sitting outside looking out the window at sunshine in the summer, thinking, I don't want to be out, I don't want to be in here.

So then to be given the opportunity to play cricket for a living, which I thought I may only have for a year when I got that first contract, I might only play one game.

I've always thought I was here for a sort of good time, not a long time, a moment sort of person rather than a sustained success.

Yeah.

Which is weird to have a 15 year career which I probably ended up having.

But I just said, look mate, coming to it was such a joy.

And that obviously has like when your hobby becomes your job, it certainly changes your life and changes things a little bit.

And I didn't love everything about it.

And there's some days where I just like.

And you find yourself moaning sometimes where deep down is still much better.

And I did say to lads often, whether they be young or like a Hilda who Was an older player, I was like, lads, a crap day in cricket is still for me better than a real day in the real world.

Even if it was September for one hour, tort on the road.

Well, right, so dropping the cap, just getting waxed everywhere for 30 years, coming off knackered like your toe bleeding, like all sorts going on.

But you sat in the change room thinking, jesus, that was still probably better than cleaning toilets, digging ditches, kind of sit on a phone selling products when you're not that engaged with it.

And it's not going to happen forever.

So why wouldn't you give it your all?

With the amount of good that can come around it, you can affect people's moods and emotions.

Like supporters stay fit for a living within reason.

Cricket's not high levels of elite sportsmanship, but has changed a bit.

And then you're in the sunshine.

So in the winters now, a lot of lads are playing franchise cricket, even great cricket in Australia and stuff.

It's the best time of your life, so why the hell would you enjoy it?

You're not going to be any good if you don't enjoy your job anyway.

I think it's totally right and I think, you know that that sense of, like you say, waking up every day with a smile on your face and saying, I'm going to do something that other people would pay to, would love to do is a really important thing.

I think also just.

Sorry to interrupt.

I think this might because I was drawn to visual people or people that have a lot of energy or characters or someone who had something about them.

In terms of my older idols in cricket like Darren Gough, Ambrose, Anna, Donald, Dennis Lilly, people who had a lot of character and personality for different reasons.

I always wanted to play the game how I wanted to watch it.

Naturally, that was me.

So I was fully aware that if I could get people engaged from the supporters or people watching the games, then even if I had a crap game, they'd almost remember me from the game anyway, hopefully for good reasons.

I don't want to be a gimmick or someone that'd be like, come on, why's he got on their head?

And he looks like he's pratting around.

But actually it was all natural passion, enjoyment.

Being backdog was talent as well, because.

You got with it at times.

Yeah, you don't get five in the first five minutes.

31 first class weekly.

So I've been, you know, there's a lot of people that would love to be at that level, but we'll pick that up In a bit.

But just out of interest, go back to your.

You know.

Obviously you said, I know your history started like, can you remember the.

You know, who was the first coach in North Ants that took you on?

And do you remember?

Yeah, I do, actually.

So David Capel was first in.

I was thinking, David Capel, God restores.

But he was the sort of director of cricket around that sort of.

He was involved in Northampton.

Yeah.

The way Northampton cricket was structured, they didn't have a director of cricket and a head coach.

Roman love bigger clubs do.

They've got finances.

Whereas Capes kind of had it all on his plate, which probably wasn't the best decision for him because he was unbelievable coach.

And because he had to deal with everything, it probably took away from that at times and the pressure probably got to him.

But unbelievable blow.

Took a punt on a clubby, let's be honest.

On the back, off the back of recommendations from Dave Ripley, who's a really good friend of mine now.

Still keeper, he was.

We giggling off out of players.

Yeah, yeah.

He was second team coach.

When I rocked up on a trial.

Day, is that what it was?

They literally said, you're right, there's a trial that you.

Because obviously when you're playing club cricket, but you play Coxeter and you're playing that sort of level, you get opportunities.

Right.

I was 24, I'd only had two games for Surrey second team, so I'd been rejected somewhere in the pro game already.

And I had a taste of second team cricket and thought, I'm not good enough for this.

I've not made any impression that the best team are the biggest team.

And then again, I'm working nine to five.

I'm having to take time off to do all this.

Then I got a call from a North End scout, actually, who I still know to this day.

He recommended me to Dave Ripley and Alan Hodgson, who was the bowling coach at Northampton.

Again, no longer with us.

Really sad.

So I turned up to this trial day, which coincided with an academy training session.

So you had a few lads in the second team, a few lads in the academy.

Most of them were hungover because it was like a Wednesday morning, so they'd probably been out on a Tuesday night.

In Northampton, I was like one of the first trialists to turn up and it was literally just almost like an open net for.

I can't remember how many other lads were there, maybe 15.

I don't know.

Main bowlers, they're obviously looking for seamers and people like Graham White, Alex Wakeley, Rob Newton, Mark Nelson, guys, I ended up being really good friends with all their netting and there's me rocking up.

I go and get a brand new ball out the bags.

I'm one of the first to rock up and obviously with the, the failure if you like had at Surrey, I was like, right, let's make an impression.

Just decided to run up and bowl faster.

Could and just bow a lot of bouncers and try and wind these guys up, but just make an impression.

Yeah, see long hair, headband.

Who's this idiot getting a brand new ball out of the bag?

Not really the done thing to run up and bowl.

Bounces with it for an hour and a half.

Yeah.

Anyway I got.

And you can see some of the lads looking and then after you get to know them after, they're like, we all thought you're a dickhead that day.

Like, what were you doing?

Who's this random idiot?

He looks like a fool anyway with this going on.

But yeah, Ripley and Hodgson, they both dragged me at the end of the session and they said, brooksie, thanks for coming today, we've got another one of these next week.

And immediately I was thinking, got to take another day off, like.

But like, yeah, we don't need you for that.

And I'm like, what have I done wrong?

I knew I tackered it, but I know we've got a four day game, Northlands twos against Warwickshire.

Twos might be the three day game here at the County Garage, so it'll be my first taste playing on a first class pitcher.

Are you available?

I was like, in my head, yes.

I just need to tell my boss at this point, I had so much time off, my boss was like, look, if you take any more time off, you've got no holiday.

Basically you used all your time for cricket mid summer.

So he said, look, I want to see you make it really understanding bloke.

So don't tell anyone else.

You're the boss at work, basically, yeah.

He said, look, if you need to take time off, just let me know and we'll make it work, work.

And I won't doc, you pay because I want to see you make it.

And I reckon I must have had another half dozen to ten days.

Everyone thought he's playing sick quite well.

Luckily I can look back now 15, 16 years later and no one can do anything about it.

And that boss, Gary Boss retired at Christmas, so I had a nice little conversation with him.

Appreciated.

And he's still a local lad, Sports office United.

But yeah, looking back, it was that Trial day and then that opportunity and sort of taking your chance.

And I took six for in that game, scored 40 odd.

It was a drawn game in the end, I think I can't remember exactly what happened, but a good friend of mine, Stuart, I was playing for Warwick, a second team.

We played at the same club team together.

And then two more games, North Ant Twos, and then David Capel offered me a contract in the space of two months.

Wow.

And do you remember that conversation?

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Now back to the podcast.

Yes.

Because he.

Remember the money.

Yeah, Right.

It was less money than my sales job.

Is it?

Yeah.

So basically, and by the way, obviously, sales is the area that we know.

That's why I brought Jack in as well.

Because as well as being a pretty ex cricketer and coach, now he's done, he's done sales and he's done the.

Hard bits for a living, man.

I'm going to say that I did do for four years really well.

But yeah, David Caper Romeo and I think I.

He'd asked me to come into a first team game as like a 12 man, be around the first team environment, get to meet people.

And I finished that, gone home.

And then he'd run me and said, we need to come in.

And I was like, I can't really.

So we had the conversation.

He said, well, after you won your contract and it was like, wow.

Like in my mind I've achieved everything I wanted to.

This is so surreal now as well.

Yeah.

So I then had to ring my dad.

I didn't have an agent at the time.

And I run my confidant from my club team, who Jason Harrison, who was kind of my mentor, especially in the early days.

And he basically, because he'd been a pro, he just said, look, you're obviously going to accept it, but don't do it.

Right away, have a think about it like, see if you can get anything else out of it.

Basically don't sign it straight away.

So I left the ground and I found the old man.

He got emotional on the phone.

It could tell.

Obviously it meant a lot to him.

Yeah.

So little things.

You do remember exactly how it went and obviously within a 48 hours I'd signed it.

Be like, right, I've got to go back to my boss now and say, look, work out what I can do.

So I think when I went down to two days a week for the, for the winter up until the January.

Yeah.

Right up until that point there was only seven month contracts, nine month contract, something like that.

So I was like, well, I'm now a full time cricketer so I'll do a little bit of sales work for a couple of days a week for a couple of months and then I'll go fully into cricket and moved in.

Manalo, Bryan and Northampton.

Was your, you know, you had three years in Gamor fans, didn't you?

Four.

Yeah, but, but go back to the idea of, you know, you know, you've been a salesperson every day and you know, and you were doing this and so your first contract was not as much as you were earning.

That's right, yeah.

So I mean my sales job back 15, 16 years ago, something like mid, like 20,000.

Something like that.

And my first playing contract would have been low 20s really.

So we're talking like a few thousand.

Yeah.

But when someone offers you a dream role that could achieve a lot more.

I've done it for free.

Yeah.

Someone said to it and did it.

Did it that whole element of someone then say to you like, you know, they wanted your dad, you know.

Yeah, sorry, sorry to hear about you.

Obviously as you, you know, we've talked about that in the past and what you died.

But we'll talk about a little bit more about that, how you shaped your career.

But you know when someone says to you this is your dream role to go and play cricket, did it then feel really weird to have that?

You know when you're literally getting the tracksuit side up and you get all the gear and you know you're then literally in a position where you're turning out as a.

I'm a professional cricketer, you know, I'm now playing like you say you've got, you know what?

I've been to Wanted Road, it's a lovely ground.

You know, you've got, you know, a couple of thousand people potentially games around there, especially to, you know, for this one day competition of beers, cheering in and chatting even out.

This is me.

I'm doing this for a living.

Yeah, it was crazy.

And I play second team cricket as if I was playing in front of full house at Wembley or Lord.

Yeah, I'm also playing wickets and running to third man and doing that I'm playing with.

But it was just again, passion, excitement, living my dream, if you like.

And then just the vast enjoyment for doing what you love doing, which a lot of cricketers I figured in my career and seeing them, they just didn't seem to enjoy it.

They almost got dragged down by the weight.

Expectation or failure.

Because in cricket, like, I don't know if failure is the right word.

I'll use it for now, but you just don't succeed that much really in the grand scheme of it, unless you're the very best.

Even then there's plenty of times where you don't have a great time of it.

But I was determined to enjoy it.

If I played one year, I wanted to play one game, take a few wickets, nab it on my cv, go back, find a job I wanted to do and that could look back, say I was a professional cricket.

That's the only mindset really that I had.

I just.

The main things I can remember looking back on that have triggered is I would go into training and you train four days a week, sort of Monday to Friday.

What time in the mornings?

Yeah, but I'd be done after like an hour and a half.

Like my bowling session would be an hour, hour of hunter max.

I'll be working with David Capel one on one, say I'm in at 9, I'm done at 10, 10, 30.

And then he's like, right, that's your pop.

And I'm like, what I do now?

And there's got cheap.

I was like, well.

He's like, well, you obviously got pretty bit of gym back then.

It wasn't like it is now as well.

And I love the gym so I'll always do extras anyway.

But I quite often find myself getting to late morning, lunchtime, midday.

What do I do now?

I used to sit in an office for the rest of seven, eight hours and then I'd be like, what should I be doing?

And obviously I feel as time went on, you fill it with hopefully productive productivity.

But sometimes you go to cinema and all this other stuff.

But luckily I didn't have too many all day as after training.

Wasn't that old school?

There's a few that were.

There were definitely a few that were.

But that was the initial thing I had to try and get around because I was just like this.

It.

Is this what you do?

And then you're trying to adjust into a new life where guys have done it for years.

Grizzled old pros that I'd played with.

How was that dressing me?

Manual.

Because obviously when you're coming into a new.

You're the new guy coming in.

Yeah.

And you're probably at that stage.

I'm guessing you would have been sales leaders.

Andrew Paul.

I mean, Nyla Bryan.

Yeah.

Dave Lucas.

Dave Wigley.

Yeah.

So there's some pros coming in.

Middlebrook joined the year after.

Yeah.

Jurassics.

Matt that actually played Yorkshire.

Is he Yorkshire?

I can't even digress.

All of them.

I played with him out of Yorkshire as well.

So he had a group of senior older guys like Johan Vanderva.

It was like a really explosive, talented fast bowler from South Africa.

Old nightmare.

He's learning from some seriously talented cricketers.

Nikki Boyer was captain.

Yeah.

Okay.

Monty Palace.

Yeah.

He's the biggest name and again at that time, he was probably the biggest name.

One of them in England.

Yeah.

We'd flip off and all that.

And Monty was.

There was a central contract England bowler at the time.

So you're mixing it with these guys suddenly.

And was there anyone.

Was there anyone that you get became that was in recluse industry was anyone that you sort of not struggle with.

But I would say to people in a team, you got 15 people.

Not everyone's going to get on right because you can't imagine everyone's going to be back buddies and everyone thinks, oh, they should be close powers.

But it's not.

You've got 15 people together.

It's not.

It's definitely not like that.

And probably that Northlands changing room was as divided as the one I'd play, but enjoyable in terms of cliques.

And you had a large contingent of your Colpac, who were obviously friendly and did a lot together.

You had a group of sort of senior grizzled older guys and then you had a group of sort of young lads coming through.

Alex Wakey, Rob Newton, Ben.

How'd you go?

Graham White.

These sort of guys coming through the system.

I'd played a lot with those guys, even though I was, you know, three, four, five years Older than those guys, I probably would have fitted into the middle group of guys who were fringe first team players.

I was drawn to those guys.

I was playing a lot of twos cricket with them and I'd got on with them.

So you're socializing with them as well.

I was getting a single ad in my mid-20s, just moved out of home, live in a new town, going out all the time.

Yeah.

Trying to juggle that with playing cricket as well and then just ignore the change room politics and all the crap that's going on and just be like, well, I enjoy playing cricket, I'm going to play in this team.

It's all I'm going to focus on.

So I want to move you on to in a minute.

So onto your Yorkshire career because that was obviously where you won your titles.

But just, just, just, you know, thinking back to the north hats, you know, you said you wanted to do one year.

Can you remember when?

Yeah, that moment when you were going in for sort of because your life is a stake, you're reaching the end of the first year, you know, you've had obviously a good year, you know, but, but you still got that nervousness of is anything going to happen from here?

And can you remember that conversation with Dave and Capel when he, when you saw, you know, had you, had you got yourself an agent by then?

Yeah, David Fulton was my first agent.

Was it?

I saw his presenter but at the time he was doing a bit of ground presenting.

I think it wasn't an actual.

I think a clash of things happened where he had to give up one of them.

But yeah, he was my first agent and he helped me get my move to Yorkshire actually, but further time.

So at that point I think I just used the PCA service, which is free negotiating service and I think I got to mid summer and again I've always had this my whole career.

I'm a little bit insecure like, well I don't truly believe, like a little bit insecure about the future.

But everyone around me is like the teammates.

Like you should be playing, let alone worried about contracts like should be in the first team.

Don't worry about not getting the conduct, just keep doing what you're doing.

And I was always a little fear of getting injured as well because my body needed to catch up to freshman cricket tenant day in, day out.

So I think like just July, August time, it started to creep a little bit.

But I did get off the two year contract.

I think initially it might have been a one year one better money, not Amazing, but certainly a bit better.

And I managed to get another year.

So we're like, well, you need to show a bit of faith in me and my age and what I can do.

Need to have some sort of security there and kind of keeping me one year contract.

So I managed to get a two year deal which gave me a lot of security and I think I signed one more deal there which was another two year deal two years later.

But I had in that contract by then because my career was taking off.

Then if we were promoted in Division 1 then I had a clause to leave.

Yeah.

So I left after one year of my next two year contract to go to Yorkshire and utilize that sort of clause, which I don't think the club were willing to do again, but I think they might have done it.

It's interesting because I obviously I know a bit about this from some of the stuff I do with a few lads.

Quick to win sport.

But you know, people, people obviously have been weird about contracts.

Contracts are weird in sport because I remember there was one that with Swansea, we have with Wilford Boney when we signed it back and I was involved in Swansea at the time and people realized some of the gold bonuses and the player bonuses and your contracts are an interesting thing.

So.

But.

But it's also quite.

So get out of at any point as well really like if you really want to, if the club decides they want to get rid of you or if you're really unhappy, then there's always a way around it.

It's obviously that, you know, moving to Yorkshire was like say Dave Fulton helped you with that.

Yorkshire is where you really started to build your brand.

I want to talk to you about the brand around the headband because, you know, and this is obviously a business podcast and much than anything else but a new, you know, but we talk about.

And I think there's a lot of similarities in sport and business.

One of the things I always remember about you was you were the first.

Even though Stuart Board might like to think he was.

You were the first, I think in the English professional game.

Dennis and me, all right, but no one in the county game.

But you sort of had this brand of, you know, wearing your headband and Martin running in being.

And that was at Yorkshire where you really sort of became more prominent.

Was there a conscious decision, you sort of trying to create the Jack Brooks brand?

Not at all, mate.

Naivety again.

Just having a laugh.

At 19, 20 years old, coming back from Australia, I started growing my hair, been traveling, all that crap to go with it and it ended up being shoulder length and you know when you're turning up with raggedy old kit, mixed kit to a trial, first team, professional environment, you just look like the most club cricketer bloke out there.

Another I started growing my hair.

I was a big fan of watching old footage with Denis Silly.

So for my village side in this Sunday competition we played in, I thought I'd turn up, try and look like him and I wore a dress shirt undone down to about it.

I had no chest hair.

I didn't wear the gold medallion either or the Joffrey train now but I basically just wore a dress shirt done there and just put a headband on, long hair and it worked to keep the hair out of the eyes.

Main purpose of coming it.

But have to keep the headband because it was already part of the image I guess and hiding the hairline well, nothing.

My hair, I'm getting bigger.

The headband had to get a bit bigger and higher.

But yeah, again going back to what I said earlier about trying to be memorable, not trying to have a gimmick but just try and be memorable.

And as you know, I know it's like watching football, rugby, things like that going on.

You can remember certain players for how they play or what they look like or if they've got their unbelievable tenet, they're on the screen the whole time.

But I guess if I had the skill to go with it, I might have some sort of image but I had no real thought process behind building it or I didn't really build it that well anyway to be honest, looking back on it, maybe ask me if.

You'D have professional help, you go.

But the point is you still quite memorable and you stood out.

Yeah, I definitely stood out at times.

Especially when you had the long hair and then you joined Yorkshire and you opened the bowl in Ryan side button.

Yeah, you had quite a large, well.

Built legend of English, very good bowler but again had the big hair.

So you got two long haired blokes opening the bowling for Yorkshire and we're taking wickets all over the place so we're doing well, getting noticed and then you guess you get to look like you do.

The thing I did look back on with a bit of humor obviously I wore an 80s style sweat like a McElroy ball, Dennis Lilly type thing whereas it Took a worldwide pandemic for my fashion sense to kick off, which I always thought was a bit strange because then you had like Broad Anderson woke.

Certainly in England, all those guys started wearing.

But they weren't headbands, they were bandanas.

Yeah.

So, yeah, I didn't ever see any of them wearing the same as what I'd done.

Don't know why, but it's just what they wanted to go for, obviously look good and they had a purpose behind it because everyone's growing their hair and they can't get the haircut.

But still, I was probably one of the few people to actually have worn a headband.

But it started and I guess a few more around the world.

Now I'm a watching cracker.

I don't think there were many of that.

So I knew people like.

But you was that, you know, you change your colors, headband to the cut of the teeth.

Yeah, I was walking.

Yeah.

Which I think is a small base.

A small.

Because you weren't providing the worst clubs will provide you with, you know, kit.

But they weren't providing you with a headband, I'm guessing.

So you had to go and get your own.

No.

Well, Northlands happened to stock the maroon and yellow Northampton brown, as I called it, maroon and yellow headbands in the shop.

And I was like, well, I already wear one.

I already.

I wore a white one just because.

Yeah, you wear white kit for Red Bull cricket.

I've never played a white ball game, so I'll tell them pro as well.

So I thought, well, I wear that.

I'll ditch the wire.

So I wore Northampton colors.

And then I joined Yorkshire and I was like, I kept out.

Everyone kept asking me at that point, well, the headbands were all right, what Yorkshire gonna stock?

And I bought.

Just sourced them online.

Bought them from this place online.

I bought a massive amount of the Yorkshire three colored blue, yellow and white.

And then Yorkshire bought a thousand bright yellow ones with the Vikings logo when they were Yorkshire Vikings and they rebranded themselves and the hashtag Fear the headband Warrior on the back.

And they said, do you mind or would you wear them in the game?

But I want to stick to the others.

Weird team of this conversation really about it.

I didn't get cut of it or anything.

They just went and spent.

So they.

They sold a thousand.

I don't know if it was 10 or 20 quid each, whatever it would have been, but they sold out.

And I obviously wore a couple and it was so weird to be at Fine Leg or at games and then you look in the crowd and grown men are wearing headbands with Fear the Headband Warrior.

And I was just like, it's the kind of thing I'd have done, though, to be honest.

I would have probably gone and bought a Danny, sat in the crowd and a few beers with your mates.

But they sold out.

They did it every year.

It was just like one off and I was like, I'd never really cashed in on it if I'd been an England player or more prominent.

I think it's a bit different as a county player, but I probably would have explored it more.

And I got asked a few times about sponsorship and I know that you did it for Ollie Sale as well, but I remember an umpire telling me right at the start because I wore this logo and he said, you got sponsors thing on it.

I was like, no.

He goes, oh, because a bit like the bat stickers.

Yeah.

There is rules around laws around it.

Yeah.

And there's a fine if you break the law.

I don't know what it is.

I couldn't even tell you what it is now.

But something like you might get fined two grand for having a low.

A sports logo on or a fashion brand or someone that you're advertising that you shouldn't be like a business.

So unless they're paying me more than that, it's not worth it.

But no one was willing to.

I think I explored it with a couple of different people.

I think one guy sponsored me year one at Northampton, but I never really chose it.

I also felt like not a sellout, but I was like, unless it's a really good offer, well, I bother doing anyway.

But I guess now everyone's trying to brand themselves and monetize things and I probably.

If I'd had a.

An agent at the time who was more cleaned up with that then I'm.

Not sure who wants to go on to your auction.

Just actually, you know, obviously you know, to a business a little bit.

Then with marketing you and you had your sales script.

What you.

You think are some of the similarities between sport and business?

Because I think there's quite a few, so many.

And that's why it's so great to have people like you, cricketers and coaches with you on the podcast.

Because there's so much business connected to sport and there's also a lot of sport connect from business.

I mean, I've thought about it a few times, especially having business opportunities away from cricket as well.

There's so many mate and having done work experience since finishing as well.

During the end of finishing trying to work out what I wanted to do if I didn't want to stay in cricket to want to remember we had.

That conversation a couple of times and.

Then go back into the real world or being around people in office environments or non sport environments.

There's so many.

And realizing that actually professional sport is only for a certain person as well.

Not ability wise but actually mindset and the mental stuff around having to drive yourself into doing the little things really well.

The monotonous stuff around being really good at the little things, committing to small, small short term and long term projects which obviously in business a lot of it can be individual but also being able to work in a team within that environment as well.

So having your own projects but also to be able to have success in an environment, bounce off each other, motivate each other, try and have the resilience around when things aren't going well.

So obviously in sport you could get dropped, you get injured, varying degrees of injury as well long term.

Whereas in business you doing a knee injury, you could probably still go to work if you're sat in the office and on the phone.

But you might suddenly took from a sales background might not be going that well.

There might be financial implications, you might be under the heat from your boss about you're not doing that well and do you fold or do you rise to the challenge?

Do you do something about it?

Do you find you problem solve?

And there's a lot of problem solving in sport as well and things aren't going away.

You're trying to bowl to York at the right field places you know you're taking everything around you, the position.

There's so many crossovers, so many like strategy, it could be anything.

So I feel like a lot of retired sportsman or people in sport are so suited to to business once they figure out exactly what they want to get into because they've got all the skills you can't teach or actually you can learn about the business or a product that you're selling or whatever you're working in.

Doesn't have to be sales when you're making a sales because I like to know and they'll probably make really good salesmen because like I said they work towards short and long term targets.

They won't just give up that easily because they've got resilience, they'll find ways around it if they're on their own.

They're probably used to working on Their own as well.

As long as there's some form of probably team environment, you could be part of a man at the team where you might have to manage them, but you've got the people skills to be able to deliver messaging or motivation to a group.

Well, I was going to say one of the things that for me about, and I talk a lot about from a sales perspective, definitely where I think cricket and bowling is really similar is, you know, as a part, I'm not sure what your strike rate was.

A strike rate, you know, is the amount of balls you bowl to get a wicket.

But I remember talking to Jamie and Craig about this and they were like, well, we'll bowl 45 balls and we expect to fail.

So yeah, I don't know what you know, but we've knowing that on the 46 we'll get the result, we'll get the wicket.

And actually, you know, it seems like not in business, a lot of people do give up too quickly.

Whereas if you, you know, oh, bowl three overs, I've got a wicket, I'm going to give up.

You'd be, you'd be cooked.

46 is a really good strike rate as well.

Well, exactly as I say.

I mean, I don't know what you're.

If you know what your straight.

Well, don't laugh, top of my head.

But you're probably in that sort of area.

Yeah, if you look at some of the world's best in Taiwan, but if you look at their strike rates, then even the very best are probably in the 40s, very rarely lower than that.

Even in the 50s is good.

But if you're less than 10, less than 60 really is.

So basically you're bowling 50 balls, all right.

And yes, you go to a plan and this goes back to the plan because you're going to try and, you know, keep them, keep bogged down or whatever else and keep them nice and tight.

But is you're not expecting to get a result for that period, knowing that the result will come, you know, that's the thing in business.

A lot think people give up on too much.

They are like, I've done it four times and I'm going to get a result.

Well, you've got 46 to go before you get that.

And that's the mindset to deliver the basics over and over and enjoy that and be good enough to be able to deliver that and think about if I can do this for a sustained amount of time, the stuff will happen that will go in my favor.

You've got to Think short term.

Okay.

I might have, might have to make 50 calls or knock on 50 doors or 50 emails.

Yeah.

Actually if I do that every week and then a couple might come in and then in six months, 12 months time things will really start rolling in off the back of it.

Yeah.

Obviously in cricket you've got to be out of the best players in the world now like Root, Smith, Kohli Williamson, these guys I've played luckily with two of those.

And on day in, day out, Yorkshire, Ruger, Williamson, two of the best trainers in the world.

They hit more balls than anyone.

Like Harry Brook as well.

They hit more balls, they train harder, they problem solve, they want to put themselves under pressure and do all the hard stuff in training.

So that's easier when they play and also they're used to it and they've already problem solved to a certain extent and then they'll have so much more success.

They obviously fail a lot and not do as well, but their success rate will be higher than everyone else's and they'll enjoy doing all the low level stuff and getting out of bed and training harder than everyone else.

And I'm glad you said that because similar I talk to me a lot about, you know, sales is that a lot of it says about practice and about being able to put, you know, to do up.

And I remember Steph Curry, the basketball player was saying, you know, he gets up at five in the morning because he's done by the time that someone gets to seven, he's already done two hours.

He times that by 100 over the course of the year he's already done whatever that figure is more than the other person that he's competing with.

And it's really interesting because a lot of people want the success.

They want to score the runs or get the wickets, but they don't do the hard work for it.

So did you find that bit was, you know, because as you went to Yorkshire you, that's where you know, you won your trophies and obviously be interesting to know about the team spirit to win, win things because business is also about winning.

What was it about, you know that, that Yorkshire era, that period had, which meant they were sales, you had great players.

But was there anything in particular that was because it.

Was it three titles you won?

No, we won two.

We almost did the three.

Oh, he always did the third.

But, but what was it about?

Because to win like what Surrey are doing now and we'll talk about that in a minute.

Coaching wise, it is a mentality thing, isn't it?

It's.

How does.

How does it.

Did it.

How did you see it develop?

Especially when you went there as a, you know, from.

From North Africa, you need strong leadership.

So when captain coach, and if there's someone above that running the ship, like a director of kit.

Yeah.

And they all need to be aligned and have different strengths, not be the same person.

So we had Andrew Geller, captain Dizzy, Jason Gillespie as head coach, Martin Moxon as a director of cricket.

Dizzy and Frog Martin Moxon were yin and yang to each other.

They were very different, but they had their strengths and let Jason run the team and Jason would let Martin do all the stuff that need to do.

And then Gary was just a strong heart on his sleeve, passionate leader who made good decisions and knew how to speak to people as he treated people as individuals.

He obviously was.

I mean, he read up on and spoke to a lot of other captains, I think, or successful captains and was always doing leadership work.

But yeah, so I remember going there straight away, being struck, obviously by a big club.

It felt professional.

Things were just done on a different level.

You felt like a professional cricket or something like that.

Not that I wasn't at Northampton, but I probably treat it like a bit of novelty most of the time because of my background into it.

You didn't feel the pressure as much.

Suddenly going to Yorkshire, a bigger move, you're earning a lot more money.

The expectation of Yorkshire is you have to win everything all the time.

You've got to be bloody good to get in that team.

And there was a lot of strong personalities that wouldn't let certain things go.

They were driving and pushing each other on, so you had to be strong enough to survive in that environment anyway, both mentally and physically, I guess, because it was just a different level.

The ability was unbelievable.

But you had a lot of young lads who were on the journey, like Root Pasto, Live, Rasheed, Balance, you know, even Plunkett was.

Had his career reborn.

The Bresnan side bottom.

Yeah, at times with eight or nine internationals playing.

And then I was one of the ones that wasn't.

So I was like always feeling like I had to try and catch up or do something just to stay in the team.

Even though I had a pivotal role and did well, I was always like, there's so many good players there.

I need to be at the top of my game all the time.

So I felt like I need to take my physicality to a new level.

I train the house down physically, go and do more in the gym, try and be a leader in that position try and get other people to sort of realize, well then watch what I'm doing.

Hopefully I can.

And if someone had come into that environment who hadn't shown those attributes, do you think that the team would have been both in them all?

Yeah.

Dizzy certainly was right.

The right person for the environment not going to go on ability.

It needs to be the right person.

So people would have left around when he came in the year before and around when I joined.

So I felt even more assured that they were signing me because just a cricket.

It was a person decision for what I could add to environment as well.

They didn't sign many non Yorkshire players as well.

Yeah, that's right.

Or it was a policy for a number of years.

Not like they don't.

It's such a big area and they produce so many high quality players.

They don't need to.

Sometimes it's just like we actually need this position.

We need a couple.

Diddy was like right, we need two high quality boulders.

Just go out and get them.

So they got me and Lynn Plunkett and him became a really good friend.

Best friends with.

Because we moved at the same time live together.

But I remember when you were saying about what were the things that sort of helped.

But I remember Martin Mox and sat us down like pre season the usual sort of preseason chats with the head coach and the Dorrit Prickett and after the first season there we'd finished second and we'd lost against Durham Escarbre in a big game and Durham won the league that year.

But they smashed us at Scarborough.

It was a pivotal game like first B second and there wasn't much between the teams.

They had Stokes and Mark Wood but they just completely smashed it.

We just didn't turn up.

And then I remember Martin Moxon preseason the next year Sen lads we got close last year.

We got promoted, finished second.

It was a successful year but really we should be winning the league and with the ability in this room and the talent.

If you look at the names and the ability in this room we should be winning the league.

But I just don't know if you guys really believe it.

So please just.

And he.

He almost like dragged us up to let's believe and have this new mindset around positivity as well.

And we just blew everyone away all year.

We smashed them.

It was close.

You got a lot of wickets.

That's why.

Yeah, I mean I did well.

I did my role.

Yeah.

I wasn't consistent in terms of per time I bowled or game or day that was consistent over a long period of time.

You.

But my role is a bit like that anyway as a strike, Nikola runs but I get fewer kicks.

But that was what I was basically told to worry about.

Just get wickets, don't care about going for runs.

So lot of well managed from above saying, brooksie, you're wrong.

Just get wickets, don't worry about going for a run.

I don't care if you get it for 10 boundaries and 10 balls.

If you get wicket next ball, you've done your job.

So I'm well managed, I'm looked after.

So from there you could just see this team grow.

And then the next year we broke the record for the most points or most wings.

I can't remember which year it was.

We didn't even back very well.

We had Johnny bestow average 100 and force his way back in.

He was like a man possessed and we bowled.

In that performance we had the best bowling attack.

So generally, in counting championship cricket, the best bowling attack wins you the championship.

You've got to solve teams out twice.

You've got to take 20 wickets every game for about 16 games.

Well, now it's 14 games back.

We won it the first time.

They'll see all 16 games.

Yeah.

And if you look every year, the teams that have won it going back, however long you want to go back, the team has won it.

Just look at the bowling attack they've got and they probably got to full quality, same as Reece at least.

Whereas now you need more injuries in England and everything and then probably a good spinner.

Whereas Surrey have probably bucked that trend really over certainly the last two years.

I don't know if it's all three that they've won it.

How many wickets have been taken by spin?

Hardly anything because they've done right.

But going to make the oval really good for our bowlers, tall, fast bowlers and we're going to have a lot of all rounders and we're going to have the best bowling attack in the country.

So I want to weigh your coaching career in a bit as you move to sober.

Just go back to the one thing I wanted to ask you, right, you know Yorkshire, you know the tough sorts up there, right.

You know, if anyone's watching this or listening to this and you, you don't know, you know, look at Yorkshires, they're called the Granite County.

So sorry to drop the podcast, but if you've got a sales issue at the moment that's really hacking you off, challenge me, I'll help You solve it.

Reach out to me.

Drop an email at hello Amesworth Business and I will help you solve your sales challenge.

There's not one I don't think I can't handle.

There's no sales issue that I can't resolve.

I've seen them all over my career.

I want to help you solve yours.

So reach out to me.

Let's make sure we handle your sales challenges and fix them so you can get back to smiling again.

Now, back to the podcast.

So is there anything you used to do to help you cope with those moments when you weren't.

Things were going your way or you're having a tough time that you know, techniques, just thinking people, strategies that people can use when they're going through a tough time or something's not quite happening.

Just.

I was always pretty good at shutting out the noise and just trying to focus on actually, what am I, what is my purpose?

What am I trying to do here?

Trying to strip right back to what is your process?

Right here?

My process is default in the size target at the other end of the pitch.

If I can deliver that app, then I can't control the ball once it lets go of a handle, once it's bounced.

The batter's job is then to do what he does.

And of course, you've got reliant fielders or decisions from umpires and all that other than everything else.

So I can.

I can't control anything like that, but I can control really what my role is and what I'm trying to do tactically.

Everything else I kind of tried to relax with.

Yeah, high pressure plan for Yorkshire, demand high results and winning results and positivity.

But they took to me because of my passion and energy and I delivered.

Luckily, early on in my career, I did deliver some good results.

You put up a bit of credit.

Yeah.

I think another team really was obviously a good time, a good team for most of my time there as well.

No one puts more pressure on me than myself as well.

So I didn't really.

I felt pressure from the outside, but all I thought was, I know I'm capable of.

I'm putting a lot of pressure on myself on succeeding.

I'm being really hard on myself all the time, even if I'm doing well, just trying to think of what I can do better.

But I really only have to answer to my teammates and my coach.

And if I know I'd put 100 effort in and I'd given my all and I'd try to do my best, but with the right energy and attitude or I can't.

Nothing else has been asked of me.

I don't.

If supporters aren't happy, they're probably not happy with the outcome because they've lost.

That's it.

I know I'm a football fat and Ice Box United is the Oxford lose 5 nil.

Even if you haven't watched the result or if you've been there you're pissed off and you're oh my God.

But actually how many of those players are probably not given their rules?

Probably none of them though it's their job.

Like be very disappointed if someone was given their rule.

You might misplace a pass or not be good enough on the day but you can't always control most of everything that happens.

It's just part of being a sports fan, isn't it?

And most people led by emotion and results whereas the inner environment, the inner sanctum they think about everything else that's going on.

You're driven to succeed obviously but there's a journey and a process to get there and that's what most are judged on.

You and I've spoken to high genan players before and actually like how many as a batsman so well and good scoring 100 but how many times have they scored 50, 60, 70 in a match winning situation and 100 in a loss probably isn't is worthwhile.

Might look good in your stats and everything but how many innings in safety?

About 500 times.

How many of those 500 times first.

In his runs or whatever.

Yeah and help the team regardless of that's what you should be.

Not so much an average over a long career or how many runs you've scored.

Be interesting to see like how many of Tendulkar's cooks roots punting their runs in winning teams or winning situations.

It's a weird way of looking at it.

Again with wickets I was prided myself on.

Do I turn up in the second innings on day four to bowl team out and we're only defending the low score more often not especially at Yorkshire I feel like I rose to the occasion.

I always enjoyed playing in front of a crowd more than nobody because it switched me on.

It gave me purpose.

I felt like I was alive and there was something to deliver.

If I delivered I would feed off the emotion of the roar from the crowd and the celebration of my teammates that would roar me on.

Whereas if there's one man, a dog rich in club cricket, minor characters, good second team cricket I'll be like right, I've got a self work but I'VE got to almost rely on something else a little bit.

But pressure's already interesting thing, you know.

You know there's always a funny phrase, a pressure craze diamonds.

But I, I remember you know when I was growing up watching cricket and I actually watched a recording of him the other day of Scott Boswell.

Okay.

Yeah.

That final, you know.

You know when.

All right.

It was a one day to honor but you know anyway that watched this, he had the, the worst over you could ever imagine.

They tapped him and they, well and.

Peter Bowler if you remember they, they, they just went up because he lost it.

He just lost.

He just lost the ability to bop or fell.

And I felt you know a lot.

Of other match in semi as well, didn't he?

Yeah, he did incred you know and, and, and it.

But that final pretty much you've done after because that, that pressure of a situation and you know having these a big, big grind the size and kinds of people.

It is funny though how people, some people can.

Like you said you thrived on that pressure and you were like to that level when there's other people that were like, you know, sadly in cases of like someone like Scott who really struggled with that.

It's a weird one, isn't it?

I've only, I've never met Scott.

I've watched it.

I remember watching it live.

I think I'm actually linked in contact with him.

I think there may have been some form of contact through since and he's obviously come out the other side.

He's a very well respected coach then.

Right.

But you obviously would have struggled for a long time that there were moments in games or when I knew I had to bow the next over and the last over 220 or I had to come on.

It could be down to me to win the game in front of a big crowd and it'd be like shit.

I've got to do.

There'll be one half of me shitting myself thinking why me?

I don't want this.

And then the other half is like think about what could go right here.

Last half full.

And some of the players that I played with luckily in like England lions environments and things is look back at Ben Stokes.

He'd always take the positive like I'm going to give you that ball.

And that's why I'm not, not everyone is like that.

There's very few people like a Ben Stokes who like give me that ball.

I'm going to go on and win this and take responsibility and do this.

Whereas I Wasn't completely like that.

And I wish I had been a little bit more confident.

A little bit.

Which is probably why I trained as hard as I did at times to give myself the best chance in that situation, even if I didn't have the full confidence in it.

So actually, I don't want to embarrass myself like a tool here.

And obviously I want to be reliable for my teammates.

So I wish I'd had a little bit of a better mindset at times.

Still felt like at times I maybe have had a little bit of insecurity or club mentality with it, but stay true to myself where possible.

But also when you look at, you know, these situations like Ben Stokes and we'll move on time, we chat all about this all day.

But you know, pum talk, work, people like that.

But, you know, people.

He said, oh, he's, you know, he was, you know, he.

When, when he scored that heavily that against Central, against Australia or anyone, he helped him win the World Cup.

But they also maybe forget the fact that he had four sixes to hit off him by Carlos brathway in the 220 final couple of years before.

And the ability to come back and have that resilience, you know, talking about business and.

And sport again is that huge amounts of resilience is the ability to say, no, I know I'm good at.

I know I'm gonna focus on my process.

I know this plan is the right approach and be a bit sort of like you say, you know, what's the word I'm looking for?

Be just dogged and just be able to say, look, I'm going to go and do this.

This is who I am.

Yeah.

And put yourself in that position.

Yeah.

Be the man to put your hand up and then try and inspire and drag the people around you.

But also the crossover to business is you have your own business and you go bust or bank crate.

Yep.

How many people then give up, really go have a hard time or, you know, even go to the extremes of killing them?

So it really dark, really dark times to flipping it and going, well, how many people really successful businessmen now have been bankrupt, had hard times with their first idea and then come back with something else and done better When I've learned from something and I've definitely been the same.

Well, my first business didn't go quite the way I wanted it to.

It did okay, but not.

But there's a great quote I was saying about Max Levchin and Max Levgin searching.

I'll share the quote on the podcast, you know, says first business failed and do well.

Second business, I learned a bit.

It did okay, but it still failed.

Third business, you know, we failed, but nest.

So fourth business, we learned a few things and we got it right, but we still failed.

Fifth business was PayPal, right?

And there's a guy that sold, you know, he's staking PayPal for 250 million and everyone's, oh, look at you, you'd be successful.

He's like, no, I've had five figures to get, four figures used to get.

Then it's the mindset around when you fail and give up.

Are you just judging it on, well, I'm no good.

Is it just done?

I'm not any good at this.

What was I thinking about in the first place?

What was my idea of success?

Or actually, do you just go back to the drawing board and have a bit of excitement around something else or something similar that might work and you're thinking about the process and learning from your mistakes along the way rather than just giving up or not even willing to give it a go, give it a try.

We talked earlier on about, you know, kids, right, and being able to have that fear, remove the fear and say, go and go and climb the tree or go and do these things.

All right, you don't want to fall and break their arm or whatever else, as I did when I was younger.

But the reality is, like, you've got to do those things to do that.

So when you've got to have that bit of fearlessness, haven't you just do, especially in sport and in business, to be able to achieve something.

Yeah, yeah.

I'm still.

Personally, I don't know how brave I would be in that situation and kiss deal put in it and it would be such a hard thing to go through.

But there's a lot of excitement in me to think about the idea that would work and things I would go towards where I could have my own business or a brand or something that was mine.

That either is a side hustle or a main thing.

Because you've got a lot of pride, you're invested in it as well.

You actually care about it.

Like the main thing I've taken from my playing career and hopefully you feel the same about your business, is you're doing something you love every day, so you're going to put probably maximum effort in and you do it.

You're not sitting there moaning about your job at all.

There's nothing worse, in a way than people who are just so grand, as I call Me by their circumstances.

Actually there is always a way of doing something about it.

It's difficult, don't get me wrong, but I'm very lucky and determined.

When I retired from playing, I was like looking at opportunities outside of Bricket, but I knew coming as a 40 year old, starting again right down the ladder, how long would it take to, to get somewhere?

Is it the right thing to do when you've got a young family?

Actually my passion's cricket.

It's what I've done 15 years.

I've probably got a lot of things in there that I'm good at that I don't realize.

Let's give that a go first.

Let's give coaching a go or some form of coaching, mentoring, see where it goes and then on the side can see what I can work around and see what business opportunities can crop in.

I think we had this conversation a number of years back and I said that same thing to you.

But yes, your opportunity but doing what you could good at and you've been good at doing those things and it's building, it's building that up from there and it's just having that ability to, to realize you're good at, you know, good at those things.

And like I said to you, you know, you're, you're, you're personal, you engage, you've got emotional intelligence to have conversations.

So.

And I think that's especially in any, I think in coaching now.

We'll talk about coaching in a moment.

I think that's the critical bit is to be able to spot and see actually look at every person different.

I learned when I was doing some stuff which ones from Brenda Rogers, who you know, was, you know, wouldn't treat everyone in the same way.

But before we, before we come on North Korea, a couple of quick fire questions for you.

Cricket related, funniest crypto you've ever played with.

Oh, wow.

Probably Liam Plunkett.

I know I've mentioned him already and he's probably my as close a friend I've got in cricket and only played with him for half of my career.

Really?

Not even that.

I just think the guy's hilarious with just how he is as a person.

He's not the confident stand up comic type, but just someone you played with that would just say and do funny stuff.

Yes.

And that's the funniest prank you've ever.

Not just that because I found him funny, but the way that everyone found him funny in the room and you get people copying things that he did because they're Funny, Yes.

People like that really amused me.

Steve Davis at Somerset I found really funny for a different way in, in completely different character.

Very introverted.

But we just have these tiny little things that he would do that I would just even look at him and we would piss myself and he would make do these stupid little gags where you'd be walking down the street with him and he would just pretend like walk over as if there was an object in front of him, like even like a tiny thing and you'd be walking with him and then you'd be looking around trying to do it as well and you're like, oh, it's nothing there.

And he's like had you, had you over and just like just loads a little practical joke that he does you.

He stood near you at the fielding drill and he's like pretending he's going to have to take the catch right next to you, crushing yourself.

And it's just little things like that that make me make me laugh because it's just like a real individual funny little thing with someone that isn't doing too serious.

No.

But yeah, and also just they're not doing it to hold a crowd or anything.

They're just doing it in that moment for you and him in a way.

And you know, I've always tried to have a laugh in my own career.

Never thought I'm a particularly funny person but I just tried to have a laugh and bring Pip back.

And I agree.

I think you make best batsman you ever bowled against.

Oh God.

So let me.

I'll do best batsman.

But the person you actually think what demolished you but really gave you a hard time and you think, wow.

So there's three, there's three guys that stood out for me in terms of world, world class players.

So I played against a lot of very good players.

Someone like an Alistair Cook who can grind you down and battle day.

I was lucky to get him out a few times but also he's got a lot of runs against me.

But three guys that are put on a different level just because of.

Yeah, yes, they scored big runs also are just like the legends of the game.

Kumar Sangatharan, even though he was touching 40, I just felt like with his record and who he is, he was of sari the back end of his career and I played against him and he scored a nearly double under against us at the ogle.

I've managed to get him out of court finally because like I said, I've got Kumar sang Akara but really didn't mean bugger all meant nothing in the game.

So him Hashim Amala again probably someone I played at the sort of back few years of his career.

He was overseas, played at various teams but I remember him playing for Surrey and at Knots.

I think I played against Sunnah again someone that I just felt like if he's on, on a certain surface, I ain't getting him out.

Makes me look.

He made me feel like that village cricketer again, that what am I doing there sort of thing.

And then Kevin Pitts really who was just.

I played against him in his peak a couple of times.

I was only bowled against him in two matches I think maybe or three.

I reckon three times never got him out but just again those three guys in the peak of their careers, we look at their records across the globe and they are the top players ever really.

I'm not saying that Cook isn't but he was difficult to bowl at but I just felt like the other three could hit me where they wanted at any given moment.

And there was obviously some very other good players, Triscovtic and other lads around that.

But when I, by the time I played against Trez he was coming to the end and you look at his record, he's probably one of England's greatest really.

Still he should be talked about as.

Yeah, I agree, certainly one of England's greatest widely players and I was lucky to play with him for a year as well.

But he was.

Well, I can't 70 by then but there's so many mates.

But those three just stand out to me as some of the best.

I was never, I never got the chance to play against Sarp Hunting or Conley played with Root and Williamson.

Williamson got him out but he was a very young lad then and it wasn't the player that he is now.

Whereas if I played against him in the last five years or so he'd be like, he'd be one of the best ever.

But we've got very lucky play with him before you and he was.

No, I think three mentioned the great ones and it was, it was who was the fastest, you know, because you were, you were.

You're a sturdy tail ender, you'd give it a whack.

Who was the fastest bowler you ever bowled?

The bowled against you and what was there anyone that you literally were like, oh my goodness.

So I've faced some decent class bowlers.

I've only been hit on the head twice and one one was by Stuart Broad and that was like a glancing bloke.

So it wasn't like I was knock stunned or anything.

But he bowled a quick spell at me.

Stephen Finn's bowled quick spell at me before when he was in his peak and I remember getting hit on the ass by him.

I was just trying to work off but wish I missed that.

Mark Wood has hit me come over if he hit me on the arm and some of these hit me as well.

And he was bowling rapid at Scarborough and Scarborough's probably the quickest in the country.

Him and Stokes were probably rapid that day and it's not nice to face someone like that, especially Mark, who because he's short and skiddy.

But I face like Jamie Overton who can crank it and like a morning more called who could crank it but they're really tall and you know if they're bowling you're a short ball, they're really banging it in.

You can kind of get under it quite easily because you see it early.

Plus I'm waiting for it.

So I'm like ducking it.

Whereas Mark Skidier couldn't always tell when he was going to bowl about.

I never really liked staying upright to play it or to get under it.

But it makes you feel alive, like facing those fast bowl.

Looking back now you're like, wouldn't want to do it now.

But at the time it's just a done thing.

You get through it.

You don't show weakness.

You've got to dig in for your team and do what you can.

So try not to get out and try and score where possible.

There's not much expectations on about 10 or 11, but yeah, they.

Those are the sort of the spells look back on when Jamie's trying to.

I think we're blocking out for a draw, maybe nine or ten down against.

Against Jamie bowling around the wicket at Taunton Bowling absolute rockets, who is quick, by the way, when he gets it right and he got it right.

That wasn't particularly fun experience, especially when he's snarling and getting up in your grill.

But.

There'S a video that I'll share.

Nailed me seven or eight pints and a bottle of wine down.

Placing Simon Jones at elections a bit.

He wouldn't have been nice and I.

Tell you now, trust me, it was as he was.

As he was right up running in.

So I was walking, my steps were walking backwards and I ended up falling over.

So there's a video that I'll share about me looking a complete idiot up.

So.

But it is that Ability to be brave.

When you've got someone that wants to.

They don't want to hurt you, but they want to get.

Yeah, it makes.

Takes a lot of bravery.

There's a bloody hard ball and if anyone wants to try this out, you know, if you want to try out, you know, get someone like Jack bowling a ball even, you know, even retired.

For example, right now.

No, you still.

It'd still be hard bloody working.

It's frightening because it's.

You got that bravery right.

Yeah, he definitely got the bravery to stay in line.

More so in Red Bull cricket and White Ball cricket.

You can use that.

I'm trying to make room swing and stuff.

But also my still one of my favorite games and favorite moments my debut was against Australia.

After all of that club cricket background and into first team cricket.

The Australian tour inside.

Which makes a fantastic story.

I'm playing in front of nobody to then full house at Northampton.

Okay, it's not a big ground, but there's still five or six thousand there every day for three days.

And it's a partisan crowd because it feels like everyone wanting Northampton to do well.

Not Ollie.

And it was an Aussie team with like Watson and Katic and Hustle and Siddal Mitchell.

So Ponting, Bretley, Michael Clark were all in the squad but not playing.

Michael Clark was in Paris with Lara Bingle, Brett Lee was carrying Griggs and Ponting was there but just kind of helping him run the team.

Really.

Such a fantastic, special, memorable game for me.

And you talk about facing class bowlers.

Their bowling tack was like Stuart Clark, Peter Siddal, Mitchell Johnson, Johnson Castrovich, Andrew McDonald.

No.

Cashews are gone.

And the offspinner.

No, before him.

What was his name?

Nathan Horrors.

The offspinner and I got 10 out first innings.

My runs to get off the mark in first class cricket were an edge of horrors past slip past Mike Hussey and then I'd Hussey and I think it was Graham and knew was the spare we could keep his had him was rested and they were both saying Colin Brooks, you're like get on with it.

So I bopped Horror so long arm for six for my second scoring shot in first class group love it.

Which was mental.

And we were nine down.

I was batting 11.

Dave wiggling was about another end to relevant laugh.

Guess who's bowling Mitchell Johnson's bowling the other end.

So this is why I was trying to score run.

So looking back now, I wish I'd faced him just to Say I'd face Mitchell Johnson and this was a Mitchell Johnson before he was the Mitchell Johnson.

Five years later this was the Mitchell Johnson that used to get barraged by the barmy army.

Bowls to the left, bowls to the right.

East shite and all that.

Bless him like it was horrible to watch at times because I think he used to come around the wicket and just bowl short just because he didn't really know where it was going sometimes.

And in that game he was bowling around the wicket and bowling short and I was just leaning on my back at one end as a pill.

I do not want to face this.

I'm going to get hurt or something.

And Dave Wiggly luckily got out so I never had to face.

But I look back now thinking be nice to have faced that because it makes for a better story.

As long as he didn't break my arm as well.

But.

So he would have been up there as the fastest.

Probably just you say cuds Mitchell Johnson but.

And the final.

What I've got to ask is always lots of, you know, you hear especially in the last week with Sam Consensus and Vera Kohli, was there any funny sledges or any moments on the pitch.

We'Ve had never barged someone on the pitch was just.

That's a bit out of tt.

But is there any, you know, you've heard or any stories of sludges because you've all heard some of them.

Is there any that were in your career that you would just think that would just make you smile as much as there was that there was the Jimmy Orman one was there around Mark.

Yeah, there's been a few famous ones in my first year or two I got copped a bit just because I was a bit different, I reckon.

And I had this.

Not wasn't a strut but I literally just had like this freedom around, confidence around.

I'd have a laugh out there to put my chest out, have a few words as a couple of moments back on at Scarborough Morne Morcos bowling bounces at me and I'm.

As soon as he's bowled a bouncer I've ducked it.

I fly up a gun.

I'm walking down the wicket just looking at him touching the wicket and he's like, don't do it, Brooks.

You don't.

He's sledging me.

Like don't fire me up sort of thing.

I was like, why not?

Like I'm not letting you walk all over me.

You might be one of the legends of the game, but come on.

And yeah, the crowd 11 it and you said, but that's theatre, doesn't it?

And I, you know, I pride and I had a place to be.

I wasn't going to sit there and let someone bully me.

And then Steve Kirby.

Game, but he hated that.

But I remember Curbs snarling and John Lewis, who probably a good friend of his, who was a Gloucester at the time, was bowling one end and Curbs was the other.

And then Lewis would go to like mid on, mid off and with like telling Curbs to, you know, kill me basically.

And Curbs like come around the wicket umpire, call the ambience and all this and he'll come down the wicket and call me every name under the sun, call me.

I went back at him and he'd say, I'm ugly this and shit this.

And so many swear words of just steam coming out of his ears.

I didn't even know if he knew what he was saying.

He dreaded it.

And I was just clinking the ball everywhere and getting away with it.

Then we shook hands at the end of the game.

We just bowled him out.

He was the last one out.

So he was out there kill.

We shook hands and I didn't know what to expect.

I didn't know who Steve Kirby was really into him.

I just knew he was a bit of a fiery character.

And lads told me not to wind him up because he could even the unpuzzled stop winding him up.

Brooks because he's good at all this ended up being my bowling coach at Somerset.

We're really good pads but at the time I was like, what to expect.

And then this, the.

The real Steve Kirby.

As soon as the game finished, he came over, shook me and hugged.

Love the theater, Brooks.

He loved it.

Loved it.

Ready?

Loved it.

I was like, you're just a lunatic then, aren't you?

Clearly just go into this mode of playing the game as someone else.

Yeah.

Which I quite liked as well because, you know, it is crushing.

Sport is theater.

But you're also there to show you care as well.

I think as long as you're not going over the line of too personal or physical contact.

Yeah.

Doing stupid things like that.

But obviously, like you say, cares and it shows because people want that, that element of they want people.

I obviously, in any professional sport, you know, I can't do what they're doing.

You know what I want to show is passion, you know, if you can show passion and show that you care and show that you want it and you work hard for it, then I'll forgive you the mistake because you, at least you care.

It's when people don't look like they care, that's the key thing.

So we could talk all day and there's lots of stuff and I'm kind of sure we talk for a while.

Obviously one of the key things is you've moved into coaching and obviously now you're bowling coach at Surrey.

Tell me a bit more about how that fields because obviously Surrey, you know, top of the league, they won pretty much.

They're the man city or the of the cricket world I always think, really and.

But to get our team started is fantastic.

It shows you, you know, how your coaching has developed and to get opportunity and how has it been to be from being coached by people like Curbs and other people and then having to listen and implement those things to now being a coach.

What have been the biggest changes for you and what advice would you give to anyone that's maybe in a business situation has been doing the work and then now suddenly having to be the leader?

Yeah, it's tough trying to probably the two toughest things, the first one is the you're not a player anymore.

She can now no longer be out there impacting the game.

So the frustration of having no control once they go onto the field, particularly with.

I'm mainly working with second team and academy lads at Union or the women's cricketers, not so much the first team lads.

We're just drilling everyone every week and it's just probably the easiest bowling job in the world for Jade, looking after them in a way, whereas you're trying to make young players better and trying to help them tactically and technically and emotionally and everything around it.

So it's all encompassing role.

But ultimately you can't go out there and deliver the ball.

And even if I couldn't have done it myself, I knew what I'd have tried to have done and what field to have set and what the right plans were and then more often, not especially in seconds.

In cricket you could probably deliver and do all right.

Whereas now you're watching guys who are learning, making mistakes, not making the right decision or not setting the right field or everything around it.

But then you're there to help guide them and help that.

So you just got to try and park the results a little bit and help them with the process and get them used to being better and actually taking a lot of enjoyment about watching someone get better.

Which is unbelievably rewarding.

And even when I was at Somerset as a player in my last few years and even at Yorkshire as a senior player I was coaching without realizing it.

Yeah.

I wasn't going up to people and grabbing them and telling them what to do or taking them one on one from a session.

I was just sat in the changing room or out on the field.

Whether it be second in worst team cricket ever been on putting your arm around a bowler telling them what to do or you know, a guy on debut running out nervous as anything.

You just go up mate.

Just enjoy it.

Or in the change room like holding court, talking to young bowlers or somebody coming up during a cripsy hunt.

I don't really know what to do.

What should I do with this or so and so has told me this or their captain or coach said this and what do you think you just naturally.

Because you're not forcing yourself on people as well.

I felt people came to me and I liked think I'm a good people person.

So naturally would engage.

I wasn't someone that would nip off straight away after a game or give no time to people.

I was actually the opposite it in a way.

I was trying to just have a laugh and engage with people and trying to flip between being serious and having a laugh where I could.

And probably the second thing is to try and not be too much of the Jack the lad and the change room which I was as a coach you've got to have that distance.

You can't just go in there and have a laugh and do things as a player which are inappropriate now as a coach you can't be seen to be doing or saying certain things.

Yeah.

And have that relationship and just be like really I've got to learn and almost back off a little bit.

Which isn't totally me but it's actually me that I've enjoyed as I've matured probably and don't need to be the life and soul and run around and say things the whole time.

They're probably the two main things.

But I guess just I look back on all the coaches I work with.

I've been I think playing for one club for 15, 20 years is great in a way.

But then how many different people do you work with and getting sound bored off and you're just used to playing on.

I know the same pitch every other week.

Same situations all the time.

Within reason.

Whereas I played for three different counties Full time and then had three loan signings.

I was in England, line set up.

I played in Australia and gray cricket and I've worked with a lot of different coaches.

So you take the best.

I tried to take the best out of all of them.

What did I really enjoy from that person?

What didn't I like from that person?

Was there only one individual?

Do you think this guy hasn't got all this person got a kid.

When it comes to coach, you don't have to mention it.

No, I don't think so because I think everyone's got strengths.

You might not get on with someone's a person.

Yeah.

Because they haven't got the people skills.

So you think there's distance.

It's not personal.

But they're really good at this.

So if I was going to be him or tell him to be better or take anything, just take what he's good at.

Yeah.

And just try not to be the positives from that.

And if I'm not very good at at something, just try and be as good as possible without bullshitting.

Where I felt like my strengths might line as who I am as a person and I've got 15 years of skill, craft and knowledge in there.

If I can get out in the right way, I'm probably going to be quite helpful to a certain level of cricketer.

Yes.

Whereas I might have to learn the technical side and how to develop younger players and sort of young teenagers where we do a lot of hands on coaching technically and dealing with younger people.

And then you work in the women's game and your communication style's got to be different.

And then you might work with people with neurodiversity and your communication levels have got to be even stronger to be able to deal with things like that.

Because there's more people than you realize that have got neurodiversity in professional sport.

You don't even think about it.

I mean when I was playing it was just almost speak to everyone the same.

If they didn't like it or deal with it, it was their problem, not yours.

But actually you can't do that as a coach.

Everyone's got to be towards the same goal but almost treated a little bit and communicated differently.

It's so rewarding though to know all this and to work it out.

And it's so exciting that coaching to me has got so many levels to it, particularly at the higher level.

It's not just about taking a mitt, throwing a few balls to players and telling them hit the top of off stone pool.

Hit a six.

It's like this pass.

I don't think to me, Gaga, mentor, whatever, you know, it's that ability to know who to put an arm around and who to give a kick at the ass to as well.

That ability to spot and to know.

And that to me is all about understanding people.

I talk about sales and business.

You know, every customer is different.

There are some customers you could be direct with, there's other customers you've got to take a different approach to.

It's the same in coaching, isn't it?

And you've got to know.

Actually, actually I've got, I've got a feeling that that lad there or that lady there is a bit quieter.

They're a bit more introverted therefore I've got to maybe explain to them the reasons why.

Whereas this person here is a real relationship person.

I'll put my arm around them and give them a hug and those sort of.

That's why you'll do so well with it because you've got those skills to do both.

Yeah, I think.

And I'm willing to learn the ones I'm not so good at.

I think that's the main thing.

If I was going to choose cricket or coaching as my next career, I didn't want to be that arrogant ex player who had all these skills that were good and you can't teach all the stuff.

You can't teach 15 years of a career with what I've managed to work out and, and what I did to bowler, wobble seam and all that old sort of stuff which not everyone who's not played the game might not have.

But actually they've got an unbelievable skill set of man management, technically gifted, helping young cricketers become more rounded or athletes.

They haven't got the skill set to take them onto the next level and manage them as professional cricketers.

So I've never played international cricket so automatically I think maybe I wouldn't ever be a good international coach because of.

I've not got the experience of international cricket.

And you can see why they're using Jimmy Anderson as a bowling coach now because of everything he's gone from that link.

Just nothing you wouldn't know probably.

So it's a bit like actually I want to be the best I can be, be the full rounded coach as possible to make myself a attractive to an employer.

You need to know what they're going to get.

Yes, I might be a good bloke with it as well, hopefully.

So then you become a attractive all around proposition and can take Pride in not being a bit of a fake with.

Yes, he's good at this but he's not bothered.

This is the stuff you can actually learn and get better at.

So let's pay attention to this side of it which is hands on coach and at all levels.

And I've tried to build that up over a few years and get better at coaching.

So I'm with the confidence in myself to say to someone, I think I know what I'm talking about with this.

So have you tried this?

Yeah.

And if you want to talk to me about all this other stuff which comes natural to me, I've got to worry about that so much because that will never go away.

Yeah.

You've got these and it also, you know, you have to spot different parts again because like, you know, Jeremy Snake for example, put up a career in sort of the mindset part of it, doesn't he?

In terms of what Psych.

Isn't he really?

Scientists and sports psychology.

So you could talk all day and I promise you every time because you've got, you know, a young 18 month old lad and a new baby on the way and your wife or your.

Or you get a fiance.

So, you know, congratulations on that.

So just the final question for you.

How does it, you know, you, you're, you're 40 now, so.

40.

Yeah.

Half.

You've got, you've got the next 40, 45 years of your life in front of you and you're sort of.

And it, it must be.

What's the interesting thing?

I've been working.

So I'm 85.

All right.

But.

But you might be if you love what you do.

Warren Buffett still works 85 and he loves what he does.

Right.

So nor might be taking a mix.

Well, how does it feel that you know, 20, 30, you know, 20 years, you know, it's a bit scary in Ghost must be kicking this.

Yeah.

In some games or, or do you look at it as being this huge new opportunity in front of.

I think it's 50.

50.

It's always a little bit of like when I finish playing or come at the end of my career.

Very daunting.

Like it's a big hum.

Like I don't know what I'm going to be doing.

So that is a little bit daunting.

Is that when you started looking at LinkedIn you come finding a little bit.

I knew what I did want to do because I'd done certain things up until, you know, good 24 is good age as an adult really to a lot of People are deep into a career, aren't they?

Yes.

Or know what they want to do.

I kind of ticked off a lot of things I knew I didn't want to do or what I wouldn't be suited that or what wouldn't motivate me.

Yeah.

So let's focus on the good stuff and try and write down a list of things I would like.

What motivates me as well is like a list of, you know, how many, five things.

What's really important to me.

Flexibility, family, life, money, all these other things.

What ranking are they?

Let's try and find roles that sort of fill the priorities a little bit.

Yeah.

And also believe now, these days you don't actually the same thing for 50 years, 60 years.

So, yes, I might be a coach at the minute.

It might lead on to.

I might become a business mentor.

I might just leave it and become something else.

Or I might end up with a really successful business that eventually I'd get my ass in gear.

I can get sorted out.

But for now, I'm tracksuit coach.

I'm hands on.

I'm enjoying it and it's ticking boxes and keeping a roof.

I've made all the usual sort of stuff, but I'm motivated to keep thinking about the future a little bit.

So it's daunting and it's 50% long, but it keeps you switched on thinking about the future.

I don't want to be that guy that's in a comfort zone thinking, yeah, I'm sorted.

I don't have to worry about anything now for the next however many years because I still think at 40, you're very young in terms of your working life.

And I could still achieve a lot in 10 years to help set up or secure for after.

Well, there's a great stat that I would say, you know, Denzel Washington didn't make.

Is it Densel.

Samuel Jackson didn't make their first film until they were 50, you know, so it's like.

So you know, the huge amount of what you think about those guys now as being legends.

I think both of them actually, you know, didn't make that.

And so many success stories of people that have been a bit older that have had that experience then go on.

Experience and wisdom you have with it, isn't it?

And experiences of things probably not going so well or you finally just probably chill and relax and you don't stress and search for things.

Things will probably find you naturally, in a way.

Yeah.

As long as you.

I think a network really helps as well.

So I'm big on.

Like you said a few times about LinkedIn.

I was actually just finding a final question because you were one of the first cricketers.

I think I know not.

There's a few of them that are on there now.

But you were on the first to be on LinkedIn.

Yeah.

And it was a business sort of connection to.

What was the reason for that, I think.

I mean, I can't remember exactly the month or year, year that I went on it, but I seem to remember doing stuff on it in covert times when obviously everyone sat around.

You're not working.

I was a cricketer, sat at home, not playing cricket on furlough with a really bad Achilles injury.

So I knew I had surgery to look forward to.

But at that point I wasn't really doing a lot.

But I had another year of contract, so I had like, right, I've got another 18 months, you know, let's, let's start putting things in place.

Because if I'm not cricket training, what am I doing?

Who am I?

Yeah.

And it seemed to me at the time the digital world, LinkedIn seemed to be going places and I created CV at the time, which I've then since redone through the help of you and your Lovely team.

But LinkedIn, I don't, still don't know exactly how real or normal or good a world it is, but it certainly helped build a contacts list.

Massive.

And people reaching out to each other.

And I think as long as I'm honest on it and I'm not someone that posts weekly, monthly, like regular stuff, I don't feel like I want to stay relevant for certain things, but I'll put things out there now and again, which I feel like could gravitate someone.

Talking to me, for example.

Yeah, exactly.

But also I was very big when I finished about reaching out for a bit of help or advice without begging.

And I think if you've built up a contacts list that you've given time to when you're career, which is really massive.

What blew my mind was how many people were willing to reach out even if it was something that wasn't overly relevant or like, you want to go work in a financial industry, I can help you with this.

Do you want to go work in recruitment?

There's a lot of things that I was like, I'd park that there's some options.

Right.

But it's people reaching out, showing they care, showing that they could help you because they might add some form of history with them.

And then there were so many people.

Obviously you just Connected with, that you've never met, that you feel like could be relevant, or you've got someone that, you know, mutual person that could be a really useful person.

So I don't spend loads of time on it, but I certainly go on it every day at some point and.

And I talk to a lot of people about, you know, to me, LinkedIn is.

It's a massive area.

You know, I.

I did a post, actually, ironically enough, last week, which I put up there just literally on day after Christmas, thinking, I'm not sure where this will go.

And I was.

Because I was a bit frustrated that Gareth Southgate and Sadiq Khan had been made sirs.

Okay.

I was a bit like, not sure what they've done.

Sounds a bit hot.

You wait.

Yours.

Yeah.

I'll be a long way off.

But Kevin Sinfield, who, you know, the rugby circuit is all his name, isn't it?

But he's not.

He's not been knighted.

He's not been knighted.

Right.

And I was like, I put this post up.

Well, it's mad.

So it's literally, as of today, it's had like 480, 000 impressions.

It's gone.

It went ridiculous.

It was like, you know, not the.

Only one probably thinking it, though.

I'm.

Well, this is it.

I actually commented on the fact.

Am I the only person that thinks this?

There you go.

1199 people have commented on it.

What is it up to now?

484,000 impressions, 196 reposts everyone.

And it just showed me.

And from that, I've had, you know, huge amount of people following and engaging and that generates opportunities and options.

But for me, it's just having a thought and an opinion and it's about being able to.

Some people are controversial for the sake of controversial, but me, LinkedIn is.

People got 90 for popularity.

Would Southgate have still got it?

In terms of general public, yeah, but it was just.

But a bit.

Sometimes it's just expressing the view and sometimes by expressing the view that I felt was actually.

This just doesn't feel right to me that a guy who I would inspire, be inspired by.

Kevin Sinfield is just a legend of what he's done and his challenges to raise money for Mer is, to me, just different level of person than a bloke that's a politician in London that, you know, for me is just.

I can't quite see it.

But anyway, the fact is you get people to gauge you with it.

So you've got half a million people nearly, that are then Saying, no, I'm with you, or seeing that and seeing your profile.

So for me, I mean, as you know, I think LinkedIn's a huge opportunity.

And I think building a network, a good network or a large network is so important as well.

It's not your network, it's your network.

Exactly.

And I'm determined to still utilize that where I need it.

Really?

What?

When I figure out exactly what I need or what I want or what I've got going on outside of cricket, for cricket at the minute.

I mean, I've got my job as Surridge through reputation.

Yeah, really.

And not even as a coach when Alex Stewart wrote me up in May last year.

Bear in mind, I've been a level three coach for a few years, but I hadn't been a full time coach, I'd start my own business.

I've done little bits for a lot of different pro sides and levels.

I was working with Sacchar and a women's team, school, university, club side, like, loads different levels.

He rings me up, the gaffer.

Probably the biggest name in English cricket, really.

Most respected man in cricket probably in this country, saying, brooksy, what you up to?

I can see you're coaching.

Can you come and give us a hand?

We need.

We've got a few days where we need some extra hands.

And I'm like, what?

Excuse me.

A, you can't say no because it's Surrey and Alex Stewart, but B, you're like, yeah, but.

And he's like.

And he put me E straight away, we said, I'm not bothered about how good you are as a coach.

We want the right person for the environment and we know you can add value for what we need at the minute.

So I was like, thank God for that.

So usually you still turn up.

Like, I need to make sure I make an impression and I do the right thing.

So in those three or four days I did, which were mainly training days, one second team day of the game and then he said, like in June, all right, can you do these 23 days?

What can I make around timely life?

And if you can't make it, we're not going to bingo and get someone else.

But just need to know what you can make so you can plan around it, make arrangements.

And then that bill every month through the summer and then it gets to like the end of summer and he's like, right, when I sort my future out.

Because obviously his roles change.

Because we want to keep you, we will employ you as your company if you like.

You could be a Consultant for us.

I just don't want you working for another county, basically.

So it's almost like we like what you're doing, can do what you want around it as long as you don't work for another pro men's team.

So it's hard for me because in a Somerset Creek fan, I've now got you working for.

Sorry, I'm looking after one of your clients.

No, you are.

James not.

He's got.

Rattan is too priced about the game for Jamie now.

But the problem is.

But no but yeah, Somerset, Surrey.

There's a rivalry as well.

There is a rival.

There is that after Tom Cohen last year.

That's been dragging on for a few years, hasn't it?

Yeah, well, Jade had a bit down there as well.

So, yes.

You'Re going to be incredibly successful doing what you do because you're that person and we got to know each other through, you know, like I said, I wanted to help you both know Jason and.

But being that support network.

So I think it is.

It's about that network and open up opportunities and linking people to do things and I have no doubt you're going to have, you know, an incredible successful career and whatever you choose to with the coaching which you're doing now or its other stuff in business as well.

So.

Look, mate, thank you.

It's been, it's been an absolute pleasure.

We've been talking for quite a long time and it goes on and on.

I hope you've been enjoyed.

If anyone has reached out, you can.

They can be on LinkedIn.

You're happy to connect with someone on LinkedIn.

So we'll put Jack's LinkedIn profile on there.

I'll see you on Instagram as brooksyferrett.

Which is your bit of fun.

That's my bit of fun.

Well, it used to be my work page, if you like.

Or Cricket Butch crept into a few kids photos and stuff, but yeah, I'm not as relevant as I used to be.

No.

But anymore it's great to see, you.

Know, especially if you, you know, my.

Coaching one is Jack Brooks Cricket, which again, I don't do enough on, but I'm going to build that in times.

Well, you will.

I know, I know and it's part of the process, but good luck with when.

Have you got a date for the wedding?

No, because we've got another baby coming.

I was going to say that's the bigger priority.

Right.

New baby on the way in what, six weeks?

I've luckily got a fiance or partner that's not huge into a big important wedding.

We both want it as low key as possible, I think.

Anyway, your two boys will be everyone.

To have the same name and be quite nice and look after everyone from an unromantic point of view.

But obviously it would be nice to get married at some point but it's not a priority at the moment.

Yeah, just get the.

Well you say new baby on the way.

Well look mate, thank you so much for being here today.

It's great to chat to you.

I could chat to you all morning, all day actually about cricket stuff as well.

But there's lots of more we'll do over over a beer as well.

But look, thank you.

Thanks.

I really enjoyed it and I hope you've enjoyed the interview, Jack.

If you have.

There's lots of other people that Jack knows and I know that if you enjoy these interviews about especially what professional sport it takes to be a successful in professional sport as Jack has been, then let us know.

We'd love to put more of these interviews on but also just to basically share insights on how to achieve success and Jack's achieved huge amount of success in his career and going to achieve a lot more over the next 10, 15, 20 years.

How long he wants to work from 85, 85 and go from there.

But no.

Look, hope you enjoyed the podcast.

That's it from today's episode until next week.

Thanks ever so much for listening.

I hope you've enjoyed it.

If you have, please like and subscribe and share it with other people.

But until then, see you soon.

Take care.

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